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Stirring The Deep

Immortal Joy


Immortal Joy



Immortal joy comes through the immortal choice.

The immortal choice is to choose the unceasing experience of divine love, thus supreme joy. This choice manifests as our heavenly Father’s will absorbs our will, so that we are no longer governed by our self-determined will of our self-made mind.

Immortal joy is sustainable and increasing joy. It’s the summation of the experiences of a reality totally crafted by our Father’s will, which flows through us as if our own will.

Have you been to Disneyland, the Magic Kingdom? It’s a place of tremendous joy for children. It’s full of amazement, adventure, and delights, and everything is crafted specifically for their enjoyment. Every experience is created for them so they can freely partake of the wonderments, as they desire. So is our Father’s kingdom. His will creates all of our experiences and we freely partake of the insurmountable joy they bring.

Becoming Children of Immortal Joy

This mortal experience is the beginning of the creation of our individuality. Starting with a completely blank canvas, as we remember nothing of our origin, we begin our journey. Upon entrance, our will, which is our ability to choose, shapes and is shaped by the experiences of this mortal realm. This dynamic forms the constructs of our mind creating a self-made mind.

With a self-made mind, we experience a life separate from the governance of our Father’s will, thus a separation from divine love. This experience reveals the limitations and weaknesses of a self-directed will and the mind it creates. Because of the lack, this mind casts a shadow of darkness that encompasses us like the cloud following us wherever we go, like the character Pig Pen and his cloud. It taints what we see, how we see it, thus the choices we make. In the absence of divine love, we also have an absence of truth, and this lack governs the choices of our will so that we continue to experience a lack of our own creation.

Eventually, this lack causes us to seek and long for something more, different, better, or greater. At some point on our journey, we are drawn to our original Source through a sincere desire for perfect love and/or absolute truth. As our will starts to turn toward this Source, what governs our will starts to change. Truth and love start to transition our soul through the Spirit of truth and love emanating from our Father, our true Source. And this inner working starts to reshape our will, thus our mind into a spirit-mind.

As we continue to grow in truth and love, our will becomes absorbed into our Father’s will. This change refashions our mind in truth and love, and in this transformation we experience divine love. We now know what is of this love and what isn’t, so that we willing and freely choose this love, which entails our will being absorbed into our Father’s perfect will. With this choice, our individuality starts to become completed. When our spirit-mind forms, our self-made mind fades until it becomes only a memory held within our spirit-mind. This severance from our self-made mind is when we experience the reality of a new birth of a soul of light, for all that we are is governed by the light. We will always have a free will; it’s a necessary part of our individuality and our ability to love. The difference is the source (Source) that directs our will.

As we become a soul of light, which leads to an oneness with our heavenly Father, our immortal joy begins to manifest. His will not only governs our intentional will, but all that is occurring within our reality. This sovereign reign puts us in a reality of immortal harmony as only he can create perfect cause leading to perfect effect, which leads to the next perfect cause. And as this domino effect continues, our reality expands through immortal harmony. This makes our reality, his reality, which is his kingdom; a kingdom of immortal joy.

Within our soul of light, his reign begins at our point of origin; the very beginning of all that we are. The point of our origin is also the origin of our will. In coming into the fullness as a child of God, through the coming forth (birth) of our soul of light, we gain his divine love as our new point of origin. Thus, we also gain a new point of origin for our will, his will. This is an incredible blessing and an absolutely beautiful reflection of our Father’s goodness toward us. Because it’s at our point of origin, we experience his will as our will. Therefore, there is no more error or stumbling around in the dark. The dark existed only to reveal and teach us about the light, and caused us to freely choose the light for all eternity, thus to give our will over to the complete governance of our Father. In this, we experience his will, which is always good and perfect, as our will. Now our individuality of will is coming out of a point of perfection, so all that follows is perfection. Because his governance feels like our will, we think, speak and act in our individuality in complete freedom. Within his absolute governance, our individuality is completed; for it is completed when his perfect love directs it. Thus, we become souls of light living love.

Our Father is soul, from which emanates his spirit. As soul, he enters and becomes a part of this creation through an oneness with our soul as he revealed in Christ Jesus. The oneness manifests as our will is absorbed into his will. This is how he, an invisible God, manifests in his creation. His kingdom come, his will be done. And this oneness sets us eternally free from a self-made mind, which though necessary becomes only a memory.

By taking governance of our free will as we freely give it, because we know what is love and what isn’t and our own limitations, is how he brings peace to earth and good will to humankind. His will is very good and creates peace, and through our oneness with him, we have the honor of experiencing a reality in which we serve as peacemakers as his reign flows through our will now immersed in his.

People fear losing their “freedoms” in “surrendering” to a Higher Power, but the opposite is true. We gain the freedom we always desired; the perfection expressions of our individuality, which can only occur in divine love. Our Father only wants us to experience a reality of perfect love, for this is the true purpose and expression of the soul, for the soul is created to give and receive love.

This exchange of wills, thus gaining a new mind which is governed by the inclinations of our perfect Father, quite literally places us in a new reality that is fashioned by our Father. His governance creates our experiences of peace, growth, harmony, and love that fill us with an immortal joy. And when all souls are in this oneness, our joy is complete. Supreme joy is found in oneness, oneness for all, so that God is all in all. This is his Magic Kingdom.

How many times have we heard this song? And how much more understanding do we have of its meaning, when we see how he comes through a connection of oneness with our soul.


Joy to the World , the Lord is come!

Let earth receive her King;

Let every heart prepare Him room,

And Heaven and nature sing,

And Heaven and nature sing,

And Heaven, and Heaven, and nature sing.


Joy to the World, the Savior reigns!

Let men their songs employ;

While fields and floods, rocks, hills and plains

Repeat the sounding joy,

Repeat the sounding joy,

Repeat, repeat, the sounding joy.


No more let sins and sorrows grow,

Nor thorns infest the ground;

He comes to make His blessings flow

Far as the curse is found,

Far as the curse is found,

Far as, far as, the curse is found.


He rules the world with truth and grace,

And makes the nations prove

The glories of His righteousness,

And wonders of His love,

And wonders of His love,

And wonders, wonders, of His love.


Author: Rachel

Contemplating the oneness of Truth while guided by the Voice of Truth produces the evolution or maturation of the soul, spirit and mind, so reality can begin to reflect Truth's immutable, divine attributes, which manifest the highest good for all. This blog reflects an ever-deepening understanding of the Truth a soul gains as its mind is renewed by Truth's pure Light.

35 thoughts on “Immortal Joy

  1. “Angelic!” Our beloved sister Amen Halleluyah

  2. Perfect harmony in the
    world is an illusion.
    When we seek perfection,
    we are seeking pleasure.
    The only way harmony
    can be identified, is
    through agreement.
    Perfectionism leads to
    nervous breakdowns.
    Be alive and accept
    the world as it is, with
    Jesus being it’s only savior.
    Then even your imperfections
    and disharmony will be
    a higher art form than can
    be understood by the natural
    man, because they will be
    born from nothing of self,
    in the same way that
    antique furniture is more
    beautiful, than new furniture.
    Agree to be disharmonious,
    but kind.
    Then you can be unprofessional,
    and accurately love.

    • You said “perfectionism leads to nervous breakdowns”, yet we know that “perfect love drives out fear”. Thus, we see it is possible to abide in perfection – for what is impossible for man, is possible with God.

      Never accept the lie that “error” and “disharmony” are the way of life. Rather believe that God has come to deliver you from these deceptions.

      • I don’t think acceptance~ creates
        error or disharmony.
        They are not the way of life.
        “They are a part of life”.
        The way of life is Jesus.
        Acceptance allows people to

        Perfect love can only be perfect,
        if it accepts people within
        the confines of imperfection.

        One of your fears may be~

        a~’fear of being imperfect’.

        This is what leads to nervous
        breakdowns, because it is
        A mental game.
        You may be excellent,
        but not perfect.
        Perfect love casts out fear,
        yes, but this statement is not
        saying or in any way implying
        that ‘you’ are perfect.
        It is saying that the act of loving
        is perfect. That love~
        ‘being applied’ is perfect.
        It is perfect in it’s effect.

        So, no, I am not, afraid
        of being imperfect,
        because I receive perfect
        love through Jesus
        sacrifice on the cross.
        His perfection has been
        applied to my error.
        So, I don’t have to ‘strive
        for’ harmony or worry about
        i.e. ‘fear’ “being delivered”.
        I was already delivered.
        But that doesn’t mean
        It means I can ‘recognize’
        and ‘see that’ perfection
        is in the Lord.
        He ‘applies it’ to my intentions,
        and this frees me from
        This is the way of the cross,
        rather than the path of

        Metaphysics seeks perfection
        for it’s own inter prizes,
        and self satisfaction.
        I seek to please the Lord,
        and He’s not a harsh critic.
        So I am able to judge you
        lightly, and without holding
        you to perfection.
        These words should be,
        freeing you.

        ~”Freely you have received,
        freely give”.

    • Anon – an illusion to the world, but the essence of the kingdom of God, and his kingdom is the perfection of pleasure without corruption.

      • Then my question is,
        what are you seeking to achieve?
        I can handle the perfection of
        God’s kingdom,
        the essence of it,
        but if you’re seeking it,
        you don’t have it.
        Your saying you don’t need
        to pray.
        Jesus, said you have not,
        because you ask not.
        So the ongoing of this
        is relationship.
        Not perfection.
        If your still asking, then
        your still needing.
        So perfection is relative.
        At least examine what I’m
        “Perfect?” So what?
        You don’t need God?
        Keep needing Him,
        and be realistic.
        Don’t lie to yourself.
        It’s an illusion to truth.
        I’m not saying your idea
        is not a good one.
        I’m saying I don’t think
        God is seeking perfection.
        I think ‘you’ are.
        So be perfect, but who’s
        going to know?
        God already knows what
        you are, and if your
        perfect, there’s no place
        left for you to go,
        but inside yourself.
        Be realistic for the rest
        of us.

      • Perfectionism isn’t our focus, but our Father’s divine love emanating from his truth. An oneness with our heavenly Father comes by our will being absorbed into his, which is the expression of perfect love. In this, his divine love flows through us and transforms us into a child of his reflection. We choose his love; and what he creates in us is beautiful.

      • Thanks for your reply.
        What do you perceive His
        will as implying or encompassing?

        When other people present
        ideas that are different from your
        current perceptions about God,
        how do you determine if they
        are speaking truth to you?

        How do you know who God is,
        what his will is,
        and when he is trying to contact
        you, in times of dissonance.

        Is comfort what brings you
        (or emotional comfort) what brings
        you, God’s highest knowledge,
        and communication,
        or do you find it more exciting
        when you are challenged by
        the depth of His Will when it
        is allowed to change your
        perspectives of Knowledge?

        In other words when love is
        present in His Will, is that
        an end in itself, or a point at
        which God begins to reveal
        His deeper secrets of knowledge.

        In other words when you say
        ’emanating’, ~does that mean~
        God is speaking, or
        you are satisfied?
        Is emanating, “seeking”?

        Is oneness a ‘rug’, that is absorbing
        ~like drinking coffee,
        or a command, and a communication
        and a language, that is actively
        grasping hold of a promise.

        God is there, you are here,
        what are you asking, and what is
        He asking?
        Or just sit, and feel the texture,
        of this rug?

        (I will do nothing except I reveal
        my secrets to my servants the

  3. Free Will

    In the beginning Was God, a single entity, called only the spirit. Within God is found completeness of all creation, spirit, soul and body. God is both male and female for he was also called El Shaddai which is of the feminine connotation of the Hebrew language. He is everything, in spirit and in creation for we all walk and have our existence in God. The supreme God is depicted as one, in spirit, and in His sum parts, spirit, soul and body as pertains to His creation. His different “parts” are explained with different masculine and feminine words in the parts as we are led to understand them, first in the natural, then the spirit. When God created and formed things, separation of His will came into being for a time through His creation process. His one and only “will” as far as man, His new creation man, was concerned was to make mankind in God’s likeness and image. “In the beginning” as in the present there has been no one to thwart God’s plan of making man in His likeness and image, in other words no one was, is or will ever thwart the plan of God or His will. From man’s moment of natural conception (or creation) all his life is within the bounds of God’s creation and will. Man’s beginning and end is willed by our Father in heaven. Man is created subject to vanity during his stay upon this earthly existence by our Fathers will. Man experiences loss, shame, and darkness from the presence of his maker according to our Father’s will. Man remains in darkness until the Father draws him to His light, according to the purpose and will of our Father. Man has no will or purpose to come to the light up until our Father draws him. Man has no will until He is given a will to come to the Father. Man may rebel, and do all matter of evil against the will of our Father while he has no will. His free will is nothing more than no will at all because man’s rebellion is of a short duration, determined by God, for; “As in Adam all die so as in Christ all shall be made alive, but every man in his own order.” It is God’s will for everyman to be saved, this was predestination. What man does in rebellion between his beginning and the ending of his “coming” to The Lord can be described as free will to rebel and choose “for a time” but in reality our Father is little by little, precept by precept training His will into us so that a true oneness comes into existence. Man in rebellion is in a temporary will of rebellion but his free will is of a predetermined boundary which will be done away with in all, not just some.

    Our Father wants us to choose to learn to love Him out of a voluntary (free will) devotion which we are disciplined into according to His will. Some come with a more willing heart than others thus they earn more of a placement of His government as what the scripture calls talents, callings and orders. The terms 30, 60, and 100 folds are actually how “willing” we are to become His will and how earnest we are in the sacrifice we are willing to make to come to Him.

    In reality we are all bound to perform according to His will, for there is no will outside of His will. We live in a temporary “insanity” until Our Father’s will becomes our will regardless of the 30, 60, or 100 fold calling. We are placed into His Kingdom according to our tried and proven obedience to His will. Again, self will is rebellion, but since every knee will eventually bow to the will of our Father there is no permanent will other than that of our Father. It is good to know that our Father’s original will for us all will in reality will one day be only one will, His.

    In the long and short of explaining the controversy about free will, there is only one will and we must and will all be disciplined to that “one” will. We have no choice in another will that will not bring us to His likeness as He determined in the beginning. His will was and is for our will to be His.

    • Good to see your posts again Sonny!

    • If what you are describing is
      true Sonny, explain why God
      sent judgement on Sodom and
      Gommorah, where He burned them
      lock stock and barrel to the ground,
      and Jesus comment about it was
      “Remember Lot’s wife”!!!
      I’m not seeing how this fits into,
      your explanation of free will.
      Hope this is a fair question to
      ask in the scope of truth, and
      the quest for truth.
      Truth always welcomes an
      If what you are saying is true,
      I think Jesus would have said,
      “Don’t worry about Lot’s Wife”,
      “everything will be OK”.????

  4. In the beginning before God created this earth, He created us as spirit beings, innocent, unproven and untried. We enjoyed all things as gifts of His benevolence. All alike for He was and is no respecter of persons. He created one, Christ, and from this one came all that we know and understand. It was God’s plan to increase His Kingdom through His firstborn in the spirit and in the natural. As a horse produces a horse and a cow a cow, God produces beings like Himself. Christ in scripture is referred to as Lord God as he is an offspring of God. If God reproduces lie beings they are called Gods just as in the Old Testament men are referred to as “Ye are Gods.” God’s with a small g but Christ is His offspring never the less. If Christ is our pattern to be made in similar likeness are we not God’s offspring as well, made in His likeness and image? We are part of God just like we are part of our natural parents.

    In his plan for expansion and giving it into the hands of His creation to do so, a government had to be devised to carry out this furtherance of His will. Since we were created perfect but not yet tried a plan had to be devised to place the responsibility in the hands of those who proved their loyalty by being obedient to the Fathers exact will. He created different classifications, 30, 60, and 100 folds. From studying the scriptures we understand these classifications to be callings and orders. According to each’s ability and obedience to His will for each of us we are placed into His government in the orders of Kings, Priest, and thus the people governed beyond the outer court. We understand the spiritual government by studying the natural government of Israel.

    Obedience was the qualifying requirement in all placement and circumstances in the government of Israel. Israel was in microcosm of what will be in the completion in the spirit as God told Moses to make sure he built the tabernacle and all the furniture and instruments according to what was shown him in the mount because it all depicted something THAT ALREADY EXISTED IN THE SPIRIT.

    We, by the natural learn the way of the spiritual kingdom of God and our eventual placement in it. Salvation for all mankind was determined before any had done any good and evil for we were not yet born into this life. Many say if salvation is for all, “why should we even try since we will be saved anyway?” By making this statement they remain in the 30 fold of salvation for they do not serve God out of love but out of fear. They do not understand the spiritual things of the scripture, only the natural. They see the lake of fire as a place of torment and only give lip service to God to escape this perceived place of torment. Had they developed a love of God by wanting to obey Him they would have the true meaning of the lake of fire revealed to them releasing them from the outer realm of darkness.

    The only thing that will permit one to walk in the light and be drawn further into it is by being obedient to the ways of God in how well they treat their fellow man and are obedient to God’s will. As says the scriptures we can give all our worldly goods to others, we can go to a natural “place” of worship, we can even give our natural lives for a cause but if these things are not done in accordance with His will we gain nothing in moving to a higher plane of His likeness. King Saul thought that the sacrifice made before the battle by him was just as good as waiting on the prophet to make it after all he made it exactly like it always was. However it was made outside the required obedience that it be done in a specific order by a specific person. We too learn this lesson as two people can do the exact same thing in the exact same manner and one can be accepted by God and one rejected. We see by this all callings do. It follow the same ritual or path but we all must obey in each’s given calling. My calling is not your calling and your calling is not mine cur we can each learn respect to another in seeing we each obey His will although our calling is not seen by another. This is the true substance of an obedient one, one seeing one taking a different path of a different calling without the criticizing of another in that which “He” God allows. Respect is a form of maturity.

    We are here to be tried, reproved and trained to meet our calling in the order our Father wills for each of us. We can make the immature statement of why try if we all are going to be saved anyway but it only shows we have little love for our fellow man or God. For those who think this way they are looking at His gift of life as something not worth being obedient to, obedient to love others as themselves. With this selfish attitude of entitlement they join the ranks of those in this world wanting to be given something without having given something of themselves. They do not see the path to rewards for obedient service. They as unwarranted welfare recipients in this world wait for others to become obedient to the faith so that these others can and will give to them, in the lake of fire. Laziness gets you little while obedience gets you all.

    We are here on earth to be placed in our pre given salvation according to how we have measured up to His will.

    As in Adam all die so as in Christ all shall be made alive “BUT” every man in HIS OWN ORDER.

    If we are privileged to understand his plan from our beginning to our end, we enter into His rest for this understanding is the sabbath day or the sabbath light, or the sabbath understanding for they are all one and of the same meaning. When we come to His likeness Revelation is fulfilled in us at that moment for us, the individual. Then comes the corporate sons, the barley harvest.

    • So God has privileged you with understanding this, but no one else,
      who reads His Word?
      Each of us is being judged by a different set of rules, and parameters,
      but you are privileged to understand this, above the rest of us?
      At least as far as the level of reading His word and communicating it is concerned.
      People cannot read His Word or hear it preached, and either accept or reject it?
      He only gave the Bible to certain ones to obey, and the rest are the privileged ones, or in a different category?
      So, God’s Word cannot be communicated or obeyed, it is ‘pronounced upon’ people “by privilege”?
      And this is why He gave us all the stories, and examples in the Bible,
      to show us that, only certain people will have this pronounced upon them?
      This is what you understand God, to have communicated with us through His Word?

      • His word, not mine. Read about his government, his callings, his kings and his priest, he chose them from among man.

        We each have our calling, we with respect, respect the calling of another. If we don’t understand the calling of another it is best to inquire of The Lord and not bring a false accusation toward a brother for their understanding.

        Yes there are callings that the immature and condescending will never see for they have not the love of God in them to see. It is similar to the three heavens spoken of by Paul. We are instructed to ask and we will receive, seek and we will find and knock and it will be opened. One who is immature and self willed is (a babe in Christ) always asking for things, one who seeks has moved into seeking God’s will, and when one has passed through this second heaven of experiences, he will knock and the third heaven experience will be opens to him. If our prayers are not answered it is because we “ask” ( first heaven mature level ) amiss and not according to His will. Seeking is a higher form of worshipping than asking ( second heaven level) and when we are knocking we are asking to come into His presence or the most holy place as depicted by the natural tabernacle.

        There is always a natural parallel to the spiritual and it is for God to decide who he reveals His mysteries to. It is my prayer that we all through the kindness of God understand all He has for us as individuals as well as corporately. The bible was written to be understood by He so wills. With thanksgiving and appreciation and love for the brethren we seek His will. By doing so the heavens will be opens to those who seek and have moved beyond the asking for personal gain for selfish reasons, and once they seek and find our Father will are a way that when we approach the door which is Christ and knock, we will be permitted to enter.

        Each is to seek their own fate, we stand or fall to Him, so we should not be concerned the path of another. It is God who calls and reveals to each His will foe them.

      • If each is to seek their own fate, I’m not seeing that as God forcing anyone to be, do, or believe anything.
        Yes, your should be concerned with the path of another.
        That is definitely a part of God’s word.
        And is how we relate to each other, and is why we would be called brothers.
        This shows no breach of contract, or disrespect but is the height of concern and love for others.
        In one persons fall, and sin, it affects others.

    • Hi Sonny, As God fills all in all … thus his perfect will governing ours from our point of origin, we become, in all our individuality, the beautiful garments of his soul. This is our Creator’s world and he will complete what he started in making a family of his reflection.

  5. Abraham chose the planes and lands away from the cities of the heathen. Lot chose the convenience of the city life of Sodom and Gomorrah
    with all the worldly conveniences close by. Lot was vexed by the day to day living amongst the pagan worshippers while Abraham kept his distance. God had His hand on Lot and brought him out of this sin city which he should not have shoes to live in, in the first place.

    This is an allegory of when God brings us out of the ways of the world he ask of us not to look back and want to return to what we have been delivered from. Thus the command to Lot and his wife not to look back and desire to return and long to be where they were delivered from. There are many lessons to be learned from the story of Lot and his wife but this is the main point.

    As far as Sodom and Gomorrah, being burned, as this being a particular proof of anything as one may depict, I would suggest careful reading of the 16 th chapter of Ezekiel. In it God carefully explains the sins of Sodom and Gomorroh and their penalty. After explaining the ruinous effect of living In pleasure instead of for God and accepting his discipline, God goes on to explain that His people, Israel’s sins exceeded those of Sodom and Gomorrah and it would be better in that day ( the day of judgment) for Sodom and Gomorrah than it would be for Israel. After explaining this difference to them God also says he will correct and forgive Israel and bring them back into His good graces. Please pay attention that He just explained to Israel it would be better for Sodom and Gomorrah in judgment than for Israel. And…….Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed by fire.

    People either has never read this or have and not understood this is a story of God’s redemption for not only Israel but for Sodom and Go or rah as well. read all of Ezekiel to better get. A context of God’s mercy. Focus on God’s mercy and grace and His forgiving nature for Israel and Sodom with favor shown more toward Sodom for Israel, His people knew the law, while Sodom and G did not. Much to learn here.

    • I’m not seeing God forcing anyone to ‘do’, ‘believe’, or ‘become’ anything here.

      • I don’t either.

      • Abraham ‘chose’ the planes and lands away from the cities of the heathen. That’s the element of free will.
        And Lot ‘chose’ Sodom. Free will again.

        God goes on to explain that His people, Israel’s sins exceeded those of Sodom and Gomorrah and it would be better in that day (the day of judgment) for Sodom and Gomorrah than it would be for Israel. After explaining this difference to them God also says he will correct and forgive Israel and bring them back into His good graces. Please pay attention that He just explained to Israel it would be better for Sodom and Gomorrah in judgment than for Israel. And…….Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed by fire.

        So a few points here.
        When he said he will bring them back ‘Israel’ into his good graces,
        he actually said he would “woo them back”, not “rape them back”,
        against their free will.

        Another point in this above statement, you have vascilated back
        and forth from a judgment in Sodom’s time period to a statement
        made by Jesus to a group of Israelite’s in Jesus time, and a reference to the nation of Israel in Ezekiel.

        So Jesus in his statement, is not referring to “the whole nation of Israel” when he made these statements, he is referring to “Individuals”, namely the sins of individual men in Israel in his time, just as if he were talking to you.

        The men of Sodom will be judged individually at the judgement, however they were all guilty of the ‘same sins’, on an individually basis, while on earth.
        They were judged on earth, and will be judged in Hell.

        Please take note that judgments are only delivered against
        sinners at the judgment, and not to the righteous.
        The righteous sins have been forgiven, and will live in heaven.

        The unrighteous Sodomite, and unrighteous Jews will receive these levels of judgment, in Hell. The righteous Jews will be in heaven.

        Some Israelites, David, Abraham and others will be in heaven,
        whereas many from Jesus time will be in Hell, because of their sins.
        Judgments of ‘whole nations’ are only carried out by God ‘on earth’.
        Jesus said, the “men of Sodom will rise up against you in the judgment and testify against you’, not ‘the nation’ will rise up.

        So your problem is, time frames, context and understanding God’s judgments after death.
        There is no judgment for the righteous, after death.
        They are forgiven.

    • Thanks Sonny … You just explained something that I could not see before. I always questioned God’s actions in Sodom and Gomorra. Never could understand how a Love in me (God) could do something like that. Just to look forward and not backwards is also a great lesson!

      • Pierre,

        You give me further thought on this subject so if you will, I will expand on this subject for an even clearer understanding that God never created one He did not already love and had a completed plan for in His kingdom to come.

        When we see all of God’s children being saved in their own order we then look at nations and individuals as on a journey from darkness to light. Israel was a people set apart for an example of what happens to all of us according to our obedience to his will. Israel was not a race but a mixed multitude of people and the covenant made to them from God was according to their willingness and ability to keep their covenant agreements. When they kept the covenants (law), they were blessed more than all the peoples (not races) of this world, when they broke the covenant they were disciplined to get them back in line. The children of Israel were made up of all the peoples of the earth, being descendants of Shem, Ham, and Japeth. When Sodom and Gomorrah fell into deep sin, they did so without any input from the law of Moses. What Ezekiel is explaining in detail is that sin will be corrected whether one has knowledge of the law or not. God is explaining to Israel that even though Sodom’s sins were most grievous and deserving of a severe corrective punishment in the judgement, God is telling Israel their sins exceeded even the sins of Sodom and Gomorrah because they had the law telling them the ways to being righteous while S and G did not. God went on to explain to Israel that S and G would be held less accountable in the day of judgement than His own chosen people would be as Israel openly and deliberately broke the law shaming God in the process. Israel was to be a shining light for the nations around them instead of act like them. Those in our day who are the spiritual Israel must be examples of God’s nature and not remain in Babylon’s company in religious works as Israel fell into.

        What it goes on to say after saying it would be better for S and G in the day of judgement than it would be for Israel, it says God would turn all of Israel from their wicked and destructive ways and put His spirit of obedience into their hearts but only after they experienced much suffering for having broken the covenant God made with them. The moral of the story is God is no respect of persons, chosen or not, the required obedience to His will is the same for all. Where Israel really failed God was that they were supposed to have refined the workings of the law and teach these ways and principles to all the nations. Instead they loved the wickedness of the nations around them and instead emulated them, even to the point of sacrificing their own children to the god of Molech.

        This is recorded in the written word to show us all the mercy of God in processing us and no matter how deep and far the fall, God’s mercy is greater than any sin he created and takes all sin and disobedience into account in our processing. We are processed through this life’s experience to feel the cause and effects of sin. God says we were born into sin, not willingly, but subjected to it in the hope of being delivered from it.

        We all experience sin, disobedience, failure, weakness, and imperfection and all sin and failure is by design and has it’s purpose in reconciliation. This is by divine design. Once we are shown the consequences of living in sin and we have had our fill, God draws us and fills us with a portion of His spirit as we are lead out of this sin nature back into the light of His being, His likeness.

        It is a complete plan of redemption for all, for this is the purpose of being exposed to a fallen nature. God cannot have billions and trillions of His offspring running around His universe doing their own thing or having their own will. With life giving freedoms come responsibilities and ones must be tested to see how much freedoms they can be trusted with, thus the 30, 60, and 100 fold categories. Those who as Christ, as Paul, and Peter obey until the end of this life’s journey will be rewarded in the 100 fold order which make up His kings and priest.

        If you study the workings of the natural tabernacle and it’s order you will understand by God’s grace the workings of the kings and priest in the daily tending to the tabernacle. The tabernacle in anti type is actually you and me as individuals in type and we then can understand and see where and how God dwells in us. Our spirit soul and body is depicted by the most holy place, the holy place and the outer court. The most holy place is the highest room in the tabernacle as the highest form of God is His spirit, the created soul is next and our body (tabernacle) which houses this spirit and soul is third. We move through these three heavens of asking, seeking and finding in our daily experiences.

        God looks at the very intent of our heart in deciding whether to trust and open His mysteries, allegories and types to us. We must in simplicity desire Him and His likeness and be willing to sacrifice this inward man of sin with his opinionated and controversial nature. Our direction is toward Him directly with the boldness to ask of Him directly without seeking the avenue of ritualistic religious practices as Israel had done. There successes and failures are recorded for our example. Until Christ came and made Himself the sacrifice, there was no avenue made for corporate man of coming to the Father in completeness. This is because the spirit was not available in our tabernacle in the most holy place until the fleshly veil, was rent thus making a way into the most holy place.

        As in Adam all died just as in Christ this same all will be made alive. The only question is since salvation is not the question but where in salvation do we fit into this salvation, is it in the 30,60, or 100 fold calling?
        God has a government made up of overcomes of self and a government is formed for carrying out His will. Do we want to sacrifice our own self will and become His? Do we want to become obedient unto the death of our self ego so that we will be of the utmost help to Him in the 100 fold or will we settle for the 30 or 60 order of callings? They are all wonderful and his very likeness will be the same in all orders. Our responsibilities and freedoms will coincide in how we through this life’s journey become willingly obedient to His will while leaving our Sodom and Gomorrah behind and moving into His full Sonship if this be our calling. (The 100 fold will be a help meet to God bring the 30 and 60 folds to maturity.)

        It is important to point out that how we perceive and understand God’s word is important but more important is the respect we show to others in this process and in their understanding or lack thereof.

        Rachel, so aptly speaks of different people having different word perspectives and views and how one does their best to understand and speak from the perspective they have been “allowed” to have by God. I see Rachel’s maturity in pursuit of our Father’s likeness and having a desire of going beyond the letter and putting others welfare beyond even their own lack of self worth.

        To be able to help in times of need we must not pay attention to immaturity because in order to teach beyond immaturity we must deal with those who are subject to it even though these same ones would will not accept the truth which would set them free from self will and ego. As God sees our lack of His Godly attributes and provides the next step for our further growth in spite of present faults we must also take on this same respect for all who lack. What I see for example in Rachel’s articles is a pursuit beyond the letter and accepting those who do not “word” their desires by the same definitions. It is said in scripture that we do not even know what to pray for for God only knows what is needed in our next progressive step.

        While we may not see and express our growth in using the same terms and words, we do however see and understand the desire to love and be loved according to His will. This is what it means to see beyond the letter and see into the spirit where maturity ( perfection) will have it’s destination. Once we envision the building as complete we look to it’s completed end , not seeing the scaffolding as part of the finished building but as things to be torn away and down. In the same way we do not look at the treatment by the actions of unregenerate man, the suffering by various circumstances of this world for they are but scaffolding used to build the house. When the house is complete the means by which it has been built will never be seen again for sin and death will be no more.

        We have an unction to follow where our Lord leads but we must become obedient in each step of the way before going on to the next level. This growth is determined by our obedience to His will and not by what we think we know and understand by the intellect of self determination. We must become and remain in understanding and compassion toward all regardless of their enlightenment or lack thereof. For example Rachel and I do not use the same words and our perspectives of “events” are different on some subjects, HOWEVER, we see the end of God’s plan for all, therefore we do not judge another in their lack of understanding because we see this blindness as a temporary blindness that God will in time correct and remove in us all. Therefore we see beyond the lack and embrace the future reconciliation of all things.

        I have not had specific conversation with Rachel on this subject but I am confident in my observation that I am correct in it because I see that obtaining His likeness and substance is more important than being right in another’s eyes and that neither of us seek the comfort of another or from one another for validation because we each know without saying Christ is the bond and it is not to be found in our own efforts or wills but in the anointing which is Christ. I see where God has allowed Rachel to stand and it is not in judgement of others but her heart is in their reconciliation to God and rejects the idea of drawing others to herself. I say this not to gain favor for we know where flattery of the flesh gets us and that is self adulation. We point all to Christ, therefore we have the only common bond that can reveal anything. If we look to another for truth we will have error but if we seek Christ we will hear only His life in the words of another.

        Compassion must carry us beyond the immature criticisms of the blind. In understanding and seeing this lack in others ( we once had ourselves) we with tolerance are willing to wait for their maturity, just as our Lord and savior waits for ours. We must aspire to take on this same maturity as we are instructed to let this mind be in us which is also in Christ Jesus.

        As we look around us in our day we see Sodom and Gomorrah, we see the false prophet, we see Babylon, we see sin and fault in a greater expression and in numbers greater than anytime before in history if for not for any other reason than in the sheer number of people.

        We are in a time of a great harvest and to the unenlightened it will be a time of great devastation by only seeing with the natural eye but to the spiritual eye it will be a new beginning of the Kingdom Age. It is all good to those who see only good in God’s plan of salvation and it will be a horror to those who remain in blindness. To escape this blindness our only intent can be to pursue His likeness and His will. We with hope and patience wait for our deliverance and seek the deliverance of all. If we look at people with Sodom and Gomorrah attributes and see the same end for them that God does we love the more. If we see these immature ones yet to be developed as worthless and less than ourselves, we remain in our sin and blindness.

        The key is seeing all included in the consummation of God’s love although not all at once , but in a very planned out order with no one being left behind.
        Then we see as He sees.

        It is a wonderful thing to see out into the future of the fulfillment of God’s love for His creation, yes for all of us. When we truly see this we have been released from all condemnation and fault finding, this in itself is a great blessing for we no longer look at others as good or evil or worthy of our time or not, but seeing them as maturing children into the fullness of our Father.

        This is not for debate or argument, it is to be taken or left for it is our Father who opens our minds to further truth and it is He who will correct us in our misunderstandings and faults. We must remain teachable with a spirit of humbleness to accept further truth.

      • When you say,
        ‘With no one left behind’.
        What do you mean by, behind?
        Where is this~ ‘behind’?

        If you are following Jesus Christ,
        or wanting to follow Him,
        see if you can find any statements
        by Him (Jesus) that corroborate that.

        This is how you will know if someone
        is in truth, or teaching error.

      • In brevity just remember that all evil recorded in scripture was brought into play to teach what is good and acceptable behavior in the sight of God. It is all about contrast. We are destined to be complete in His likeness, it is being exposed to evil which opens our eyes on how to treat and not to treat others. This is the purpose of evil, to teach good.

        In the beginning recorded in Genesis after God created His plan, including all good and evil, He pronounced it as only good. It was Eve, our weaker part of our soul which called good evil,and evil good, while our Father called “everything He created as only good. The evil God exposed Job to by instructing Satan to test him was for his good, not for some evil purpose or anything that he had done wrong. When Paul turned one over to Satan (as recorded in Corinthians) so that this person would learn obedience it was for his good, think of this, Paul a person such as ourselves having power over the evil one called Satan to cause a good and corrective attitude in a disciple.

        To the pure in heart all things are pure and good and for the ultimate consummation in all things where even death itself ceases to exist. You can’t have a tormenting fire of hell without having died and if death is done away with then the concept of a literal burning hell cannot exist because hell exist in death.

        Hell is in the mind of earth dwellers which we are and when this death experience ( absence from God) is completed through the regeneration and reconciliation process death will be over with and we will live, thus the end of this death experience.

      • You never commented on or answered my

        So, I will comment on your statements.
        Your statements are interesting, but not from
        the Lord, as far as the way you are believing
        and interpreting, in your life.
        Your words are based on the Bible, but not in it.
        Your words are not from His book.
        There formatted on terminology,
        but not on what God actually has said.
        Interpretations must come from the Holy Spirit.

        For instance, God’s Word says,
        “Whatsoever a man soweth,
        that shall he also reap.”
        So God has set up a principle to keep you
        from reaping evil.
        The word says that Jesus spoiled principalities
        and powers of the evil one and made a show
        of them openly (defeating them).
        So, we are not in the dispensation of Job
        anymore, which by the way is the oldest
        book in the Bible.
        We are now in the dispensation of the
        Lordship of Jesus.
        Who has give to us all things that pertain
        to life and godliness.

        Psalm 5:4
        You are not a God who takes pleasure in evil;
        with you the wicked cannot dwell.

        So, here we see, that, if Jesus is dwelling
        in you, then evil cannot dwell there.

        Also, in the case of David with Goliath,
        we see how judgment is brought ‘from
        God’s men’, against evil, and evil men.
        God showed no mercy on Goliath,
        even having his head cut off.

        Paul said, behold the goodness and
        severity of God.
        On ‘you’ goodness, if you continue in
        his goodness.

        So, decide which group, which people,
        you want to be in.
        Your of God, or of the Devil.
        God’s Word says that every nation that
        does not serve Him, will be turned into
        Hell. Stated in His Word.
        God cannot lie, and will not lie.
        So, I hope and pray that you would not
        want to lie, or misinterpret, God’s goodness,
        or His Word.
        His wrath is reserved for evil, and
        for evil men.
        We see this when Pharoah, and his troops
        were drowned in the Red Sea.
        I pray you will not participate with them,
        God never uses evil to teach his people,
        he teaches His people with the Holy Spirit.

        If you interpret God’s Word through the
        lens of evil, you will have a warped view
        of what He is telling you.

        God said, “I have set before you life and
        death, therefore choose life that you
        may live”. And this Goes for Bible
        If you call God evil, you are placing the
        attributes of Satan, on God.
        I pray you would disavow yourself
        of that practice, and find the truth.
        God is a good God, and has no part
        in or participation in evil.
        He has committed his kingdom to
        good men. Not evil men.
        God’s judgment remains on the wicked.

  6. When we choose righteousness we choose “His will” , when we make choices outside of His will we choose our will. We have freedom to choose and make good and bad choices within the confines of the perimeters set by God but no one has any will whatsoever to change God’s plan. He said not one jot or one tittle would in no way go unfulfilled in the fulfilling of His plan. There is no plan outside of God’s plan, no righteous will outside of His will. Man has a will to rebel and resist and reject God until God determines for that person’s processing to start but if every knee shall bow to the will of God, then who’s will wins out in the end. We do not have free will to choose our ultimate destination for this was predetermined before we were born. Resisting God and going off on our willful journey as the prodigal son worked for him for a time but when the prodigal came to his senses he returned to his fathers house and submitted again to his will and glad to do it. Sure we can rebel and call this free will but do we have the power to ultimately say no to God? Do we believe every knee shall bow as promised and if we believe God that this is so then where is our free will to change His will. We humans murmur, complain, run away, lie cheat and steal against the will of God but this so called free will is limited to a time that will end when God says come.

    Some come willingly, some come kicking and screaming just as natural children but come they will, the plan is being followed to a jot and tittle to allow man to have a rebellious spirit for a season but is this man’s choice and will or is it God’s plan and will to leave man to his own devices and schemes “for awhile” that he may learn as the prodigal his choices only lead to misery and loss.

    We think we choose our way and can circumvent God’s will for us? This is impossible. When we have been schooled and disciplined to come back home as the prodigal son, was it our will to choose or were the circumstances devised by God to show us when we rebel against his will we will get nothing but a miserable outcome. How many reading these lines have not suffered revisiting God having gone their own way or lived without His guidance? We do not have the faculties nor the desire within ourselves to choose righteousness until it is placed in our hearts to accept God and obey His will. As we choose His righteousness we are choosing His will and this is by His design and prompting our will to become His and His ours. Do any think we can choose evil and forever forsake God and His will for us? After all it is said as in Adam all die so as in Christ all will be made alive but every man in his own order. When man comes to his order at the time of God’s choosing he will submit to another will, we have no choice in the matter.

    I see where people see free will as a choice and I too see it in a similar but not altogether in the same complete way. It is just that some will choose to obey the path that is already set before them which is set by His will and some will turn back on the high calling in Christ Jesus but they will never the less be saved, “yet though as by fire” as recorded in scripture.

    Yes we can choose while God has left us to our own devices but this is also His will, not ours. It is recorded we had no choice in the matter, we were created subject to vanity so while we are brought to the place where we choose His will, we speak as though we are the authors of our salvation. You see it is a matter of perspective and who is encouraging who’s will within us. Is it our will or His will for us to “choose” Him? If it is as God says we do. It even know what to pray for to achieve His likeness the by what and whose will do we move forward?

    God’s will is His plan and His plan is His will. What did we create and what will did we place in each of His creation?

    “Choose you this day whom you will serve.” People say this is a free will choice and we have the ability to accept or reject God. We can prolong our path but we cannot choose anything outside His ultimate will for if every knee shall bow, it is His will, not ours for this to be so.

    The love of God draws us to Himself and some are not deterred to follow Him and we do this willingly because the love of God has been so revealed to us we want to please our Father by acting according to the will we have been drawn to.

    We are destined to “choose” His ways at our individual appointed time and we will choose to love when the will to love has been given to us to do so, we can no more will love because it is not in man to choose good for His ways are not our ways and the carnal mind is enmity to the spirit mind. We are trained from a carnal mind in the natural rebellious will in man to that of accepting a better way. We in our carnality desire nothing of the spirit, we have no will to seek the Father until He puts it there. It is then not even our will in that we then choose a better way because we are then choosing the direction of a new will that is given us by the Father. We can take no credit for we can not add one cubit to our stature by taking any thought.

    We choose what we are given to choose. God first gives us of His love and we follow on seeking more of the same. We follow His will to perfection. We should not confuse following and obeying for self will. Self will leads to ruin while seeking His will leads to life. While it is a matter of perspective of seeing His will, we see the more important thing of knowing we shall all be completed in Him according to plan. We can only hope to have His will increased in us until we are engulfed in His likeness. We are lead by His spirit to act according to His will, thus making His will ours.

    I think a lot of us are saying the same thing although from a slightly different perspective. For example I see and hear what Rachel is saying about free will and if you look at it from A growth perspective we see a progressing that neither can deny. By shifting just slightly we are agreeing that our will must become His and His ours. When His love increases in us to the point we want nothing but to please the Father we are acting according to His will and then the will He put in us, He has then made it to become our own, in His likeness.

    • Well, thanks for responding, I see you have commented
      here, rather than above.

      Ok, your comments here are good.
      However, you push them a bit, if not a really
      really really, too far,

      For instance I agree with a lot of what you said here.
      But the major statement~, no.
      For instance,
      As far as choosing God or not.
      “You” have to decide.
      God will not decide this for you.
      God cannot override that, or he would be a liar.
      Then His word would be useless, meaningless.

      Once you have chosen Him, yes, then he can
      activate his “plan” for your life.
      And take authority.
      But otherwise you are serving Satan.
      And Satan can activate his will in your life.
      The more foothold Satan can gain in your
      life, the more he can control you,
      unless you are saved.

      You might say it this way,

      ~~~God’s will~ is~ free will.

      That is God’s will.

      But I agree with you, God is ultimately in
      But without Jesus, you will be
      held responsible, for all your decisions,
      and all of your Sins.
      This is what will send you to Hell.
      And it’s written in his Word.

      If you choose Jesus, your sins are
      forgiven, and he will take responsibility
      for you life, and failures, within the scope
      of His plan.
      That is the benefit of being His and
      being saved.
      The Bible says forget not the Lord,
      and all his benefits.

      God puts a difference between sinner,
      and saint.
      Just like he put a difference between
      David and Goliath.
      Two different men.
      One with God, one without God.

      No, there is no plan of salvation for
      evil men. You have to choose Jesus,
      or you are not covered, and there is
      a Hell to shun.

      There is a battle for your soul,
      between God and Satan,
      but God has won the battle,
      but you have to choose God,
      to be on His side.

      • John 6:44-45 No man can come to me, except the Father that sent me draw him: and I will raise him up in the last day. It is written in the prophets, And they shall all be taught of God. Every one that hath heard from the Father, and hath learned, cometh unto me.

        As stated here and in other scripture God chooses when we start our journey back to Him after we have been subjected to His absence doe awhile. We do not choose when we start for we have no desire to come to God.

        You said:

        “God never uses evil to teach his people,
        he teaches His people with the Holy Spirit.

        If you interpret God’s Word through the
        lens of evil, you will have a warped view
        of what He is telling you.” End quote.

        So you want to throw out the book of Job because it shows God using Satan and evil for good? So any scripture that disagrees with your concept you simply say to does not pertain, is this how I understand how you arrive at your conclusions? You are saying by your statement because Job is in the Old Testament it has no relevance and that God only writes truth in present terms? God is the “I am” and His truth does not change for you yourself said God cannot lie but are you not calling God a liar by saying these things as you do? Does suffering come from being subjected to evil or to good? It comes from suffering. It says Jesus learned obedience through the things which He suffered. This world’s influences are evil, and we are all subjected to evil. When Christ was tempted with evil was it for evil or good? It was so that it could be recorded for us to learn from His temptation of evil, not good.

        The devil has more baptized people in His grasp in organized religion because they have been deceived by him into thinking they are righteous while they are still being influenced by an evil nature. You can tell by the fruit of their lips and the arrogance of their words and in thinking the water they were baptized in was purer than the water another was baptized in. So you are saying that the Christ I accepted into my very being and that I have a personal relationship with is false while you have a superior knowledge to mine and your acceptance of this same Christ is accepted by Him while mine is not?

        What arrogance and self righteousness. Do you really think by you continual putting down others views come from a spirit of self righteousness is just, just because you also claim Christ? I can tell you your continued ridicule of others is not of Christ.

        One should not ridicule another because they cannot understand the words they speak. The words I speak, they are words of a higher awareness and an understanding that comes by years of obedience and denial of self. The things I see come from a life of denying myself and taking on the spirit of Christ and not merely mimicking His words as though I know what they mean when I do not.

        No, I am not the only one who sees many revelations and mysteries, there are others who do the same and understand more than I but each of us have what God gives to us. I do not claim any specific righteousness for the revelation of knowledge given to me is for me to see at this point in my journey just as all others are given the degree of understanding according to their ability to obey. knowledge is something of a schoolmaster while righteousness is what we obtain from God by being obedient to His ways.

        People do not give up their evil nature when they are baptized or join together in a building which they falsely call the church. This is but a beginning not an end as some have been deceived to think. This is why so called “Christians” continue on in displaying their evil nature calling good evil and evil good. The five foolish virgins are called virgins as well as the five obedient virgins that God rejected. They are both followers of Christ but five are true followers and five are lacking in understanding of the knowledge given to them which the lack of oil in their lamps represents. What was and is the difference in the two?

        I will tell you; one reads the scriptures desiring light which is the pursuit of the love of God in their intent and one reads in a self absorbed darkness wanting to climb up some other way. This evil way is forever studying knowledge but never able to come to the truth because it is the intellect of knowledge that is being pursued instead of His loving nature. There is a huge difference as depicted by the five wise and the five foolish. One reads in the pursuit of loving God and all of His creation, saint and sinner alike just as he has been taught to do, just as Jesus has shown us, and that He loves all. The foolish instead searches and finds fault in what any person has to say, while the wise shows compassion and restraint on the foolish’s ignorance. The foolish had (have) much ( erroneous) knowledge and could quote Christ sayings verbatim out of the New Testament while their hearts are far from Him.
        The foolish think righteousness came by mouthing words and impressing the flesh instead of furthering the love of Christ by showing restraint, compassion and a true understanding of the scriptures. The foolish continually think gain is Godliness while the wise see that the sacrificing of what the foolish call righteousness is in reality self will, a self determination of what is good and or evil that comes from an angry disposition of self righteousness because they cannot put forth the love of God and hide behind an endless confusion of quoting scripture erroneously.

        To have knowledge and an abundance of it is the fools treasure, the treasure of the wise is to desire understanding in how to use and see knowledge which brings out the love of Christ in their own temple so that what shines out of it is from true light, a light that glows with the love of God for all that cross their paths for the wise see all in all and understand all means all. The foolish see that “all” only means those who agree with them. The foolish see ones with a more in depth understanding of the scriptures as mad as they accused Paul of being. Many left following Christ for Him saying they must eat His flesh and drink His blood in order to be His disciple not understanding He meant to take in and drink His life for the life is in His life (blood) and the bread is taking in and assimilating Christ in our beings to be digested to the point where the bread ( Christ) becomes all that we are. Those who quit following Christ for these sayings had not had their eyes opened to understand the parables because it was not their time. Had it been their time they would as Peter would have had their eyes opened to recognize the truth of the matter. It is so today that there are ones who do not understand the sayings about Christ and do not understand even the most fundamental principles of Life in Christ Jesus.

        The foolish virgins simply have a knowledge of vein repetitions but have little substance when it comes to showing the fruit from the tree of life which is none other than the good nature of Christ. When Christ drove out the money changers from the temple what he was actually saying to those who understand where the true temple is, is that the temple in which we are should not be a temple where we “exchange ” that which is true for a substance of vanity and gain.

        The foolish virgins dress like, talk like, and quote scripture as does the wise. However the wise have surpassed the foolish because they have learned to have and display the love of God which they have been given by obeying the spirit which is love for another. The foolish virgins continue on in their display of having a knowledge without any substantive love for another for they did not seek to understand what their knowledge actually meant for they thought God would hear them for their much speaking.

        We must leave the rudimentary knowledge of the scripture and become wise virgins by surpassing the righteousness of the foolish virgins.

        We do this by looking through the lens’ of God’s will and love for all of His creation and forsaking the darkened council of seeing souls as eternally lost.

        Just because one may use and say the word Christ in defending their own personal view and understanding of the scriptures does not make one an automatic follower of Christ no matter how many times they darken the door of a substitute of the true church. We must become one in the ranks of the wise by desiring all the ways and likeness’ of Christ while rejecting the show and shallowness of the foolish followers of Christ which are in reality the foolish virgins spewing out self righteous judgement.

        With the love of God presented to us, let us choose it and pass it on and embrace it so we will have increase of His good nature.

        Darkness will be swallowed up in light. If we pursue light we pursue God. Let us encourage all to leave the teachings of the foolish and enter into the teachings of the wise or those who have entered into His likeness and ways. We must leave the talk, and enter into the substance, then we have Christ.

      • To discuss with others you would have to
        choose a teachable spirit.
        If your ears are closed, that would not
        be a problem originating with me, or
        something stemming from my comments.
        Even Jesus was accused of having a
        devil and being of the devil,
        so I can do no worse than Him,
        as far as trying to share with you,
        I take comfort in your persecutions.
        It goes with the territory.
        Jesus said, if they have called the Master
        of the house Belzebub, how much more
        shall they call you.
        Saying, blessed is He whosoever shall
        not be offended in me.
        If you were following the true Christ,
        I don’t think you would be finding offense
        in my comments.
        However, to each, his own.
        If my teaching and sayings to you, are
        correct, they will prove a blessing to
        your understanding.

        If you choose a ‘higher and lower’ mentality,
        that is not originating from my comments.
        I don’t treat people as ‘higher or lower’
        But there is definitely a ‘right and wrong’,
        as far as understanding language, and
        in what God is saying.
        I see no dishonor in commenting on what
        God has taught in his Word.
        This is something I was attempting to
        share with you, and I understand why you
        are uncomfortable talking with others,
        Your “higher and lower” viewpoint,
        disavows comments from others.
        It’s a great protective device for you,
        but it serves no purpose for a conversation.
        To the pure, all things are pure.
        Some people see everything as evil,
        and “out to get” them.
        (“That person is putting me down”.!??)
        I don’t think so.
        I have better things to do, than to try
        and put people down.
        I think you would be more comfortable
        in life, if you would let your walls down.
        (But that’s probably an insult?)
        No, it just means you would be able to
        hear what someone is sharing, without
        taking offense.

        “More power to you” a far as your walk
        with God, and history,

  7. Anon,
    Again, and again, My reply (s) to you are not about our difference in views, it’s your disrespectful and judgmental name calling. You insult another and when they call you on it, they are the instigator all of a sudden?

    It is not what you believe it is how you conduct yourself. I would suggest you learn some manners. Do you think calling others derogatory names such as “poltergeist”, mystics, buddist, etc, etc because they see different is a proper thing to do? You write your insults and these derogatory terms down for all to see in the most condescending of ways and then you say you don’t do these things! You say you are being misunderstood and because people such as myself “attempt” to correct your childish and immature behavior, you have been persecuted.

    You have clearly said things to others on this forum which were clearly out of line and when they have corrected you with an obvious factual corrected statement you have never apologized to them, not once, you justify one demeaning comment with another. If a comment made in defense of your insults is your persecution then where is your compassion, humility and concern for another’s view come from? One set of these attributes come from Christ (tree of life) and the other from the tree of knowledge. You are saying another’s corrective answer to you is your persecution? How old are you?

    Make no mistake about it, go back and read your comments, your “sharing” is not the problem with you.

    Where in any of my comments do you find me addressing Rachel or anyone else who see different than I do with disparaging and condemning childish comments, including yourself?

    It is not anyones’s views as you suggest and you cannot rightly divide, it is the way you so easily cast anyone aside who has another opinion. Find one example where I respond with unkindness to Rachel or any other with disdain for their view as you do. You will not find it. Now if they continually put down another for their views (and not their views) I would attempt to get them to see the error of their ways as I am doing you.

    Most will not comment to you out of fear of looking like they are not being kind. My intention is to try to get you to see your error in this name calling and the way you approach others.

    I know how one may perceive my comments but I my intention is not to change your views for that only God can do, for that matter He is the only one who can open any of our eyes to a better way.

    The fact that you anonymously give insult will one day be of benefit to you for when God opens your eyes to your shameful nature which is not of Him you can thank God your sins have been hidden.

    • No, your problem with ‘me’ stems
      from your being “overly religious”,
      which causes you to have no
      sense of humor.
      If you truly served the Lord,
      you would have no issues with
      my attitude because a tree is
      known by it’s fruit, and my fruit
      is good.
      Your problem is you have no
      freedom in your heart
      and you cannot understand
      someone who does.
      Your problem is misinterpretation
      of God’s Word, and it causes you
      to be “evil minded”.
      You look for evil in someone where
      there is no evil.
      This, is ‘you’ projecting your “evil”
      onto my statements, because you
      are not grounded in the Lord’s
      righteousness, you cannot relax
      and have fun in conversation
      which causes you to feel threatened,
      because you don’t know God’s love,
      “””and do not love yourself”””.
      That is why, I have shared my
      statements, on God’s love with you
      that he does not use evil to
      produce good.
      God is not angry with me,
      for being free,
      and he is not paranoid against
      You are the one who is projecting
      your anger outward, to others.
      Rachel has a sense of humor,
      and that one fact allows me to
      understand where her heart is
      even though we may have a
      different understanding of Spirit.
      Your problem is ‘you’, want to see
      evil. It’s what your looking for.
      God isn’t looking for evil.
      I don’t allow the devil to accuse
      me of evil.
      If you don’t understand the difference
      between God, and the devil,
      you’ll stay offended all day long.
      God is offering you freedom.
      Receive it and take freedom.
      Then you can offer it to others.
      If you’re in bondage to how you feel
      about others, walk free from it.
      Feel a different way.
      I’m not making you feel angry.
      I’m not making you, anything.
      You, are making you feel angry.
      Go free from it, and be happy.
      This ‘is the message’ God has been
      trying to get to you.
      It’s what He’s been trying to bring
      to you.
      It’s what I’ve been speaking to you.

  8. GOD is slow to anger and rich in mercy… But His patients does stop, though Infinite… There is a probation period. I hope, the disturbed thinking person, realize the shortness of time and that thier probation will close… Better repent before it is to late and turn from his wicked ways

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