As I read and hear about all the unrest around this issue, I felt compelled to share part of my story with you. This is a difficult topic to talk about – no doubt. My prayer is that you will listen with an open heart and that you will get from it whatever God has for you.
This second video is my thoughts on an issue that is often raised when people mention leaving the church system – the assembling of believers mentioned in Hebrews 10:25 not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching.
Some Unhealthy Fellowship Verses: 2 Corinthians 6:14-18, 1 Corinthians 5:9-13, Psalm 26:4-5, 1 Timothy 6:5, 2 Timothy 3:5
I’ll be posting more related videos in the following weeks.
Rachel
Good videos…thanks for sharing!
We left our home church a couple just shy of a couple of years ago…we had questions what is the purpose in all this? Our church was becoming more relevant more like the Willows and Saddleback, the message was weak, the music was terrific. More and more questions began to come to my mind that seemed very much against every that I knew off. Our focus was not in leaving the IC, but seeking a “biblical church”. So we left found a couple to visit that meet the biblical standards…but oddly after a couple or so months…the same questions arose. Then i began to worry, because these churches had John MacAthur visit, some leaders came from his college…I mean this was the doctrine I held too and now I am questioning the whole church system…it came out of left field. I believe now that it wasn’t the doctrine or seeker methods…it was the system God was taking us out of. It hasn’t been pretty…I have been rebuked from others…I have been blocked from a so called brothers FB page because I am, in there opinion…”lost and a heretic! There is so much more to tell. But felt compelled to tell you this because your story is similar to mine and from what I know from others in the same boat…it is the same. Our church friends pretty much think we are crazy most don’t talk to us, the ones that do, which is a very small few..still fellowship when we can. Its funny though they try to stay away from the “church” subject…except one dear brother who oddly enough likes to bring up Hebrews 10:25? Huh! Sometimes I can be a little to bold and opinionated, I suppose that is the Italian and German in me!:)
We are be stretched and our minds are being scrubbed from all the religion in our minds. I trust that the Lord will bring us through the wilderness and if He leaves us in the desert…then that is OK too!
Blessings to you
Mike
By: mike on September 13, 2009
at 5:24 am
Mike – thanks so much for sharing your story! I know others are hearing this call out and it can be hard facing the judgment, rebuke and rejection of others – and some opt to keep with others instead of following the Spirit’s prompting. That is why it’s encouraging to share our stories with one another – that is why I wanted to share my story. Jesus told us we would face persecution – and I too have faced rejection. It isn’t easy being the odd man out – but it is peace with God we seek not the world. And to experience His provision and care out in the wilderness is amazing.
By: Rachel on September 13, 2009
at 5:47 pm
How did your children respond in not going to church?
Did you ever feel like that if somethings were disruptive in your life and walk you contributed it to leaving the church? Sometimes I wonder if my circumstances are because I am not going to church? I know that is religion but I suppose it also says on much control it has on you.
Hope you don’t mind me asking questions periodically?
mike
By: mike on September 25, 2009
at 7:23 am
Mike,
I don’t mind at all – I enjoy the dialogue. I enjoy the interaction.
I don’t have any children of my own, but step-children who live on the opposite coast – so we don’t get to see them that much. But from my friends and even growing up, I think too often people rely on the church to teach and train their children in spiritual truths, when it should be the parents’ responsibility. I think to start a family fellowship is really important – being in God’s Word talking about His truths and why we live as we do.
As for things being disruptive in my life – I don’t feel that – but actually the opposite. Yes, there has been persecution from other believers, but that is always to be expected as Jesus warned us. So I’m not quite sure I am understanding your question right – so let me know
my walk and life has gotten much stronger and far better since leaving the church in every way – I’m often amazed and overwhelmed with praise – but it has more to do with cultivating a real intimacy and relationship with God that changes everything in your life for the better than leaving the church. Not that you don’t go through challenges but the challenges are always an instruction from God to walk more inline with His truth and will and bring you closer to Him. Before I truly drew near to God in spirit and truth – I was always running in circles, fighting the same battles, living without wisdom that created all kinds of havoc – not anymore.
God desires us to draw near to Him and worship Him in truth and spirit and draw near to Him through His Word. I think He is drawing people to Himself to abide in a intimate and powerful relationship. It should have always been this way, but things turned upside down and made it more about the church. Most people are actually drawing near the church and its truth and ways and not truly God. Because of what the structure has become – the church gets in the way of developing that intimacy with God and that is why God is drawing people to Him outside the system and into His Word with power. It’s like the church puts blinders on people – they see just enough to think they are walking in the light but they are being blocked from truly abiding in the fullness of the light, make sense? Life is abiding in Him. I am rambling bit here – so I’ll stop. But let me know if I addressed your question.
By: Rachel on September 25, 2009
at 5:55 pm
I suppose what I meant was when you leave church and circumstances arise in your life…challenges whatever the case maybe and instinctively you think and others will reinforce that it is because your not in “church”. So God is disciplining you. You know the same concept, if your financially poor, its because you aren’t “tithing” or let me see your check book and see who you love more? Something along those lines.
Your right about the family leading there children through the word. My previous pastor and I had a meeting before I left the church and that is one thing he told me…find a church with a good children’s ministry to teach your kids…I thought, isn’t that my responsibility.
Ironically I was invited to my old church tonight to play pool and games with an old friend from there. They didn’t have a “game room” when I was there…I guess nothing has changed whatever it takes to bring them in.
Thanks for taking the time to respond to my questions….it has been edifying.
mike
By: mike on September 25, 2009
at 7:18 pm
Hi Mike,
Oh I see . . . but I don’t believe that nor have I experienced it. Others are quick to judge or place blame including ourselves. We have to seek what is happening in our livers from God and His truth.
Anytime
By: Rachel on September 27, 2009
at 8:03 pm
I love your response to the church is being taken over. The inference to the Bible is good. Could you point out the verses that speak directly to Gods Word. This will make it crystal clear for me. The Word is everything. Great job. Thank you.
By: Dr.James A. Lee on September 25, 2009
at 10:50 pm
Hi Dr. Lee,
I agree the Word is everything. Incredible isn’t it?!
I put together some verses on the topic in a post http://stirringthedeep.com/2009/03/09/leaving-the-sanctuary-verses/
By: Rachel on September 27, 2009
at 7:58 pm
[...] for Young Believers In previous videos, I shared my story of coming out of the church system – not the true church, body of [...]
By: Foundation for Young Believers « Stirring the Deep on October 10, 2009
at 7:00 pm
I’m currently struggling to find a church home, but for slightly different reasons than you talked about in your videos. I’d like to hear your take though and see what advice you might have in my case.
I’ve been attending a Baptist church for nearly two years (I’m not a member, just an attender). The true gospel is preached at this church and they are blessed to have between 5-10 elders who are all terrific preachers and faithful to the Word of God. Everyone is extremely welcoming there. My issue (and this is my issue, not theirs) is that I feel like I live a bit too far away to contribute to the church in a meaningful way. The church is centered around a major university and most of the members and attendees are within walking distance or a few minutes away. It takes me 30-35 minutes to get to church, and the same amount of time for any small group as well. I’m also probably one of the oldest people in the congregation as well (I’m 39). So coming from a bit of a distance and not having any ties to the university makes me feel like somewhat of an outsider. I’ll stress again that this is my issue and that everyone there has always been 100% welcoming.
I’m struggling with what to do next. I’ve felt convicted of late that I’m merely a church consumer who shows up for the sermon and then returns a week later to take in the sermon again. Should distance be a reason to look elsewhere for a church ? The former pastor at the church called New England “hard soil” and I’ve definitely found that to be the case. Solid, Bible-based churches in my area are few and far between, and where I attend now is by far the best I’ve seen near where I live.
Your videos struck a chord with me because I definitely long for the kind of fellowship you talk about, but I’m not sure if I will find it doing what I’m doing now. I don’t want this comment to turn into a manuscript, so I’ll stop for now. Would greatly appreciate your thoughts on this Rachel….
Blessings to you
By: Joe on October 13, 2009
at 5:38 pm
Joe,
Finding the right fellowship is one that takes a listening ear to God’s voice. And sometimes that means we have to seek in His Word for awhile to quiet all the other voices that we have heard (from our past, society, other Christians and our own) on this topic. We have been so indoctrinate about what we should do in this area that sometimes it is difficult to hear what God wants us to do- especially these days. As you know from my videos, I believe God is calling people out of the church system to His Word and to other types of fellowships.
My thought is that you would take some time to seek God’s will for you in His Word. You need to know from Him where He wants you – not to rationalize it out or hear it from someone else. You need to know you are living His will from Him then you will live it with conviction. Not that you aren’t seeking but I would encourage you to persist and be patient – to allow time for all the other voices to quiet so you can hear His.
We often get to anxious to “do” because of outside pressures and the will of others being pressed upon us, when we need to be still in His presence and trust His guidance. If we seek with all our heart, soul and mind and that means putting our ideas aside, He will lead.
By: Rachel on October 13, 2009
at 6:14 pm
I got run out of my church that I pastored for 10 years. I would have never gone back, but I wanted to raise my sons in church. I dont blame you though. Church is full of a*sholes
By: john edwards on January 15, 2010
at 12:57 am
John – no doubt there are MANY issues with the church – but it was God’s spirit that pulled us out – it was His Word and truth. We actually had a great time socially speaking.
By: Rachel on January 15, 2010
at 5:56 pm
John are you related to Jonathan Edwards?
I agree with having your kids in church…have you had any luck?
Since we have not been in church for a couple of years now..I have still been feed and continue to lead my family the best that I can. i do however feel the pull to go back to get my sons involved? But then I ask myself what will they be involved with how will it change them? My fear is when I feel I need the “church” to help raise my kids who am I putting my trust in? I should walk humbly and fear God before my children. Like I said, it is a pull to go…but I wrestle with it. A good source for a teaching children, having a Godly home is a man named, Denny Kensaton..http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=28568&forum=35
blessing to you brother….
By: mike on January 15, 2010
at 6:17 pm
Mike – thanks for your comments.
By: Rachel on January 15, 2010
at 6:34 pm